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Bill Venners Posts: 1994 Nickname: bv Registered: Jan, 2002 Artima Forums Get a New Look Posted: Feb 24, 2002 10:20 PM Reply Advertisement After several years using a PERL CGI-script to run the forums at Artima.com, I finally have replaced them with a servlets/JSP solution based on Jive Forums (jivesoftware.com). The new forums are here: http://www.artima.com/forums/index.jsp Please try them out and let me know what you think by replying to this topic.

Hiran Posts: 2 Nickname: hiran Registered: Feb, 2002 Re: Artima Forums Get a New Look Posted: Feb 25, 2002 2:59 PM Reply I like the new look Bill. It's really good. Keep up the great work! Hiran > After several years using a PERL CGI-script to run > the forums at Artima.com, I finally have replaced > them with a servlets/JSP solution based on Jive > Forums (jivesoftware.com). The new forums are here: > > http://www.artima.com/forums/index.jsp > > Please try them out and let me know what you think by > replying to this topic.

Bill Venners Posts: 1994 Nickname: bv Registered: Jan, 2002 Re: Artima Forums Get a New Look Posted: Feb 25, 2002 6:52 PM Reply > I like the new look Bill. It's really good. Keep up > the great work! Thanks. It's nice to finally have Tomcat running on my server. I spent about a month enhancing the JSP skins that came with Jive Forums. It's a nice product, with tons of functionality for $100, but it requires a lot of work to integrate it into an existing site. It was the first time I'd used JSPs. It turned out I liked them, but I think that's because I was already very familiar with both HTML and Java. I did find that JSPs are harder to read than either plain HTML or plain Java. Perhaps the main thing that struck me, though, was a seemingly intrinsic difficulty in building user interfaces to functionality (not information) with web pages. Although it's way easier to write HTML than Java, when it comes to creating a network app like this discussion forum, using web pages means that functionality like dialog boxes are kind of a pain to implement. I spent a good deal of time trying to figure out what should happen when you hit the Cancel button on pages like Your Settings and Your Watches, and I'm still not 100% happy with what I ended up with. My experience was that although its easier to learn HTML than Java, its easier to create a UI to an "app" with something like Swing than with JSPs and web pages.

Alain Ravet Posts: 19 Nickname: aravet Registered: Feb, 2002 Re: Artima Forums Get a New Look Posted: Feb 26, 2002 4:59 PM Reply Bill, Just a quick remark : the reply box should be wider: 54 is definitively too short for a line. 80 chars is rather standard these days.

Bill Venners Posts: 1994 Nickname: bv Registered: Jan, 2002 Re: Artima Forums Get a New Look Posted: Feb 27, 2002 12:06 AM Reply OK. I can bump it up to 80. I and my beta testers also felt the box was a bit small, but I was afraid the Jive guys had some reason for it. Thanks for the suggestion.

Charles Bell Posts: 516 Nickname: charles Registered: Feb, 2002 Re: Artima Forums Get a New Look Posted: Mar 5, 2002 6:55 PM Reply Hey Bill, you've done an outstanding job on this site. It must cost you some bucks to do all this. I would like to find a place to do some java servlet jsp apps, but I can't afford all the monthly ISP fees. Any ideas??

Thomas Taylor Posts: 3 Nickname: lonebyte Registered: Feb, 2002 Re: Artima Forums Get a New Look Posted: Mar 6, 2002 2:23 PM Reply Charles, you have severial choices: java.isavvix.com - a java community effort, which provides disk space and java based servers you have access to, among other things. you can get tomcat jsp container/web server from jakarta.apache.org (keep in mind that the windows operating system behaves as a web)

Bill Venners Posts: 1994 Nickname: bv Registered: Jan, 2002 Re: Artima Forums Get a New Look Posted: Mar 6, 2002 3:38 PM Reply > Hey Bill, you've done an outstanding job on this > site. > Thanks. > It must cost you some bucks to do all this. > Well, perhaps in opportunity cost. Given the recession, training engagements are way down, so I decided to seize the time to do a lot of infrastructure-building work for the website and for writing books. I only paid $100 for Jive, on which the new forums are based, but spent at least an entire month hacking away at the JSPs and fixing a few bugs in their basic JAR file. Jive is here: http://www.jivesoftware.com For the database I decide to use PostgreSQL, not MySQL, because PostgreSQL supports transactions. It does seem the MySQL does now too, but theserverside.com was using PostgreSQL, so I decided I would too. Plus I have a database friend who recommended PostgreSQL. Anyway, both of those databases are free, and I think PostgreSQL will be plenty good enough for my purposes, at least for the forseeable future. PostgreSQL is here: http://www.postgresql.org I also use Tomcat for my servlet container, which is also free. It did crash once I think, so I want to either use inittab or create a cronjob to restart it if it crashes. Haven't done that yet. But as far as performance and load is concerned, so far so good with Tomcat: http://jakarta.apache.org/tomcat/index.html > I would like to find a place to do some java servlet > jsp apps, but I can't afford all the monthly ISP > fees. > Yeah, I do pay $300 a month for a dedicated Linux server. It's $250 a month for the server and $50 a month for backups. That price includes a team of system administrators who help me do things and keep an eye on my servers. But I end up doing much of the system administration stuff myself. I kind of enjoy it. I started out on UNIX, and it is kind of fun for me to mess around with it. Anyway, my server is at INETU and I've had a good experience with them: http://www.inetu.net/ > Any ideas?? The other thing that's nice about Java is that I actually do all my development work now on, if you can believe it, a Machintosh titanium laptop running OS X. You can develop JSPs and servlets on any platform that runs Java. If you are looking for something connected to the internet, then I'm not sure what to tell you other than shop around for ISPs. Some may let you share a server for $25 or $30 a month and still do servlets, though I never found anyone who did that.

John Doe Posts: 1 Nickname: ace513 Registered: Mar, 2002 Re: Artima Forums Get a New Look Posted: Mar 8, 2002 2:04 PM Reply This is a pretty good iterface

Charles Bell Posts: 516 Nickname: charles Registered: Feb, 2002 Re: Artima Forums Get a New Look Posted: Mar 9, 2002 12:43 PM Reply Bill, Thank you for all your insight. I've got Tomcat 4.0.3 running on my home and work machines and am continuing to do more with it. I don't know how you afford $300 a month. I haven't figured out how to generate that kind of extra income so I could have a real web site with all the servlet/jsp stuff. Mostly I just try and answer programming questions for free and have been happy at doing that. I've got a very nice paying day job as an instructor at a large power plant. I used to be a full time programmer on the power plant simulator. The restructuring era downsized the group twice and I volunteered to go back being a full time instructor. I get to do programming on the side now. I've only got about 6 years until I can retire at 55. So life's not so bad. I have yet to get a serious offer for programming services for hire outside of my day job. I suppose I have much to learn before that would ever happen. I will continue to help with questions from your site and always try and remain positive and helpful to people no matter what their question is. Best of wishes, Charles charbell@bellsouth.net

Bill Venners Posts: 1994 Nickname: bv Registered: Jan, 2002 Re: Artima Forums Get a New Look Posted: Mar 12, 2002 10:05 PM Reply Charles, > I will continue to help with questions from your site > and always try and remain positive and helpful to > people no matter what their question is. > Thank you for all the answers you provide here. I appreciate it and I know the questioners do too. This whole Answers Forum thing won't work unless people are willing to spend some time giving answers as well as taking them. I am hoping to foster the development here of a community of people interested in "distributed behavior on a network," as James Gosling would put it. It will be fun to start to get to know people through their interaction in the forums. Bill

SrinivasaraoCh Posts: 3 Nickname: seenu Registered: Mar, 2002 Re: Artima Forums Get a New Look Posted: Mar 21, 2002 5:33 AM Reply > I also use Tomcat for my servlet container, which is > also free. It did crash once I think, so I want to > either use inittab or create a cronjob to restart it > if it crashes. Haven't done that yet. But as far as > performance and load is concerned, so far so good > with Tomcat: Bill, I have a similer problem. We have our propritery server which was implemented in java. If it get strucked up, I have to kill it completely and restart a new instance of it. Actually, we have mechanism to stop the server. But,it cant listen if get strucked up. I have to kill it forcibly, and start a new instance. I could start a new instance without killing it, but it is binding to the port. I have to free the port. Everything I have to do automatically and remotely. What is cronjob? Can you please suggest me how to solve this solve this? Seenu.

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